Old Stage and Wagon-Wheel Traces

Subject: Old Stage and Wagon-Wheel Traces Sun 15 Jul 2007, 7:24 pm

Concrete evidence of the past, the old ruts left by stagecoaches and wagon trains are usually ones in which the history-lover doesn't mind being caught up in.

I was directed to some of these, still to be seen, in the northwestern Collin County of the late-1970s. During the early years of that decade, I also was shown the ruts of an old wagon road which had been carved into the bank of Austin's Bull Creek (I think it was). As Girl Scouts in about 1968, our troop was pointed to an area through which the Butterfield Overland Mail was said once to have crossed Camp Rocky Point (near Denison).

It has been written that wheel traces may be viewed in the vicinity of Bartonville and/or Copper Canyon in Denton County. The Texas Historical Marker erected in 1972 -- at Honey Grove (Fannin County) -- states that at that time, "a small segment" of the Central National Road could still be seen "skirting Lyday cemetery in the W. D. Wehrmann, Jr., pasture, just east of FM 904, southwest of Dial."

On this wonderful web-site which chronicles the studies and explorations of Richard Denney, the viewer is shown the (potential) wheel ruts left on the old Marcy/ Springfield Trail (Hutchinson County?):

http://rdenney.bizland.com/TexasHistory/Marcy%20Trail/marcy_trail.htm

...and also the uncertainty with which the visual historian can be faced when attempting to date or categorize the tracks left by 'old' roads.

Does anyone know of other examples of traces remaining to be seen across our state? Also, how useful might aerial photographs be -- such as that from Terra Server shown on Mr. Denney's page -- be in identifying historic routes, seemingly obscured in the landscape?

Thanks!

Holly
_________________
The woman of the frontier made the best of her situation, for she had developed a respect for the land that gave her freedom as well as the courage to live in it.
~~~ from the perspective of Anne Seagraves

Subject: Re: Old Stage and Wagon-Wheel Traces Mon 16 Jul 2007, 6:44 pm

Thanks for setting aright the misconception about the traces of the Butterfield Mail passing through Camp Rocky Point. I am not disappointed, however, if we youngsters might have been shown an old stretch of road upon which Sophia Porter herself once passed (?). Wink

It surely would seem that the amount of traffic a wagon road/ stage route formerly saw would be one of the factors influencing the survival of traces. Of course, some of these later were followed by automobiles and eventually paved.

The wheel ruts shown by Richard Denney on his web-site don't strike my eye as being particularly old, but then again, it is hard to tell.

What do you think is the best method for determining whether such ruts truly were left by horse-drawn vehicles of yore -- consulting old maps; listening to (or reading transcribed) oral history; considering geology; and studying available, aerial photographs, perhaps?

I'd forgotten that I'd learned by heresay that the traces of the old road which led to Breckenridge (near Richardson, Dallas County) remained to be seen in the late-1960s and early '70s. Also, a woman who lives near the intersection of FM 678 and FM 922 (in Cooke County) told me some years ago that wagon ruts were visible on another family's property near her home. She was uncertain of which road they might have been attached to.

Anyway, the old ruts fascinate me Smile

Thanks again, M C.

Holly
_________________
The woman of the frontier made the best of her situation, for she had developed a respect for the land that gave her freedom as well as the courage to live in it.
~~~ from the perspective of Anne Seagraves

Subject: Re: Old Stage and Wagon-Wheel Traces Wed 18 Jul 2007, 11:33 pm

M C,

This road belongs to a later time than the old wagon traces, but reminds me of how byways can stick to their former patterns while their names may be changed.

The homes in the suburban neighborhood where I grew up were built in the late 1950s and early 1960s. Around the corner from my home, a street followed the western bank of Cottonwood Creek, as so was named by the developer, 'West Shore Drive.' North of West Shore and across a busy thoroughfare, many new houses were constructed as the '60s progressed. The street into which these lanes and their neighborhoods fed was an extension of West Shore Drive -- or so I long thought. A map produced during the 1950s proved that the northern part of the street was, in fact the older: it once had been called 'Ford Road' for the family to whose farm it led. As the area sub-urbanized, the romantic notions of the developer won out, I suppose. Ford Road was replaced by West Shore to join 'Northlake,' 'Clearwater,' and a host of descriptive street names.

M C, I have some questions regarding Denton County. Mary Jo Cowling's classic geography -- published in the state Centennial year of 1936 -- speaks of two east-west trails which stretched through the county during settlement years. The first, known as the Ranger Trail, forded the Elm Fork (or the 'Big Elm') at the Fish Trap Crossing. Would this then follow the general route of Fishtrap Road of today? Also, 'Geography of Denton County' tells of the 'Indian Trail,' which crossed Elm Fork at the same place as did the later McKinney Road. The river bottom at the second ford is said to have been of stone, thereby suitable for crossing in most seasons of the year. About where would this spot be today?

There do seem to be quite a few wheel ruts remaining in the creek and riverbeds of our state, as good crossing spots must have been well-known and the early roads -- though their own traces may have been erased by time -- fed their traffic toward them.

Thanks, M C.

Holly
_________________
The woman of the frontier made the best of her situation, for she had developed a respect for the land that gave her freedom as well as the courage to live in it.
~~~ from the perspective of Anne Seagraves

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Subject: Re: Old Stage and Wagon-Wheel Traces Sat 21 Jul 2007, 8:29 pm

M C ...

I plan soon to be renewing my relationship with the Girl Scouts of America following a hiatus of many years ... this time from a view of about half a foot higher queen

This clarification of the identity of the trace which was (is?) visible at Camp Rocky Point seems to be important. Have you shared your finding with the office there or with the Council (Cross Timbers?)? If not, I will be happy to give them a call.

Who knows? We might one day be sending our daughters and graddaughters to a wonderful place of outdoor adventure, fellowship and education .... fondly called, 'Camp Sophia.' sunny

Holly
_________________
The woman of the frontier made the best of her situation, for she had developed a respect for the land that gave her freedom as well as the courage to live in it.
~~~ from the perspective of Anne Seagraves

Subject: Re: Old Stage and Wagon-Wheel Traces Sun 22 Jul 2007, 12:14 am

M C,

I'm sorry; I missed the first part of your posting.

I believe that Sena Mounts created the large, pictoral map which hangs in the Emily Fowler Library in Denton. If I remember correctly, it was fashioned in 1936 as a State Centennial project (?). I have long loved that map and do have a copy of it (somewhere). What I've wondered about are her sources. For example, were the locations of the Indian villages pinpointed through oral tradition? I'm thinking that these villages would have been of those of immigrant tribes; Delaware, perhaps?

Also, a similar, comemorative map was created for Cooke County's own centennial, in 1948. As you probably know, it originally appeared in the Gainesville Daily Register, but a small copy was reproduced of it in 'Cooke County: Past and Present.' I had thought that this was a draw on the idea of Sena Mounts, but perhaps there were other such maps created to illustrate the histories of Texas counties? Anyway, they're neat!

I do recall you and Dave having discussed the McKinney Bridge road on the DHS message board. Thanks again for your direction and clarification; will take out my Denton County map and try to piece together the old roads and their environs.

Holly
_________________
The woman of the frontier made the best of her situation, for she had developed a respect for the land that gave her freedom as well as the courage to live in it.
~~~ from the perspective of Anne Seagraves

Taken from: Roy Franklin and Helen Gibbard Hall, 'Collin County: Pioneering in North Texas,' Nortex Press, 1975 ... a book which would be a great asset to the library of anyone with an interest in the local/ regional history of our state.

Also, according to this source, traces of another road -- the old Alton Road -- extending westward from Collin to the former seat of Denton County, remained to be seen ca. the middle of the last century. These wheel ruts were extant in the vicinity of Foote Road. Evidently, this route was in use as the main road westward from McKinney through about 1925.

Interestingly, while the traces pictured above are quite deep, the Cedar Springs - Buckner - Bonham Road was the earliest to be laid in Collin County. Its use is said to have declined about 1857, when a new route was constructed from Dallas to McKinney. Perhaps this old track continued to be traveled by the local folk after that time.
_________________
The woman of the frontier made the best of her situation, for she had developed a respect for the land that gave her freedom as well as the courage to live in it.
~~~ from the perspective of Anne Seagraves